During a recent interview on The Bill Simmons Podcast, Max Kellerman discussed leaving ESPN and his relationship working with Stephen A. Smith on First Take. Kellerman replaced Skip Bayless on First Take before Smith requested his removal from the debate show. In 2023, Smith said that he “didn’t like working with [Kellerman],” and in 2024, he called the chemistry issue on First Take “more [Kellerman’s] fault than mine.”
Kellerman, who has returned to a busy sports media schedule in the boxing world, had long remained quiet on the subject of ESPN, First Take, and the relationship with Smith, despite Smith’s frequent jabs. But he opened up more — and in doing so, drew praise from Michelle Beadle — in an interview with Bill Simmons, who certainly loves to talk ESPN exits.
In addition to explaining why Smith has no hot takes, Kellerman said that it “didn’t really feel like a relationship was forming” with Smith on First Take.
“I never had to worry about when the little red light came on that it wouldn’t be a show, but it would be like, you don’t want to be undermined,” Kellerman told Simmons.
Kellerman added, “If you’re doing a debate show and you’re a competitive person, why would you want me as a partner? That’s bad. You want to go 15 rounds every day with ‘Muhammad Kellerman?’ That’s just bad. It’s embarrassing.”
On Friday night, Smith addressed the Kellerman interview for roughly 25 minutes during Straight Shooter with Stephen A., and he also shared a clip on X.
“I ain’t gonna lie to ya’ll,” Smith began, after his program showed a moment from the Kellerman on The Bill Simmons Podcast. “I had my researchers check and make sure that wasn’t AI. That that wasn’t some sh*t that somebody just made up. I had to double-check that sh*t. I really, really did. I couldn’t believe it.”
Before Smith got to responding to Kellerman’s comments, he had a message for Simmons.
“Number one, and this part I’m serious about,” Kellerman explained. “Bill Simmons. I got love for you, bro. Got to do your job; you got to ask questions. But to ask a question about whether or not I wanted to put in the work? Seriously, bro? Me? Come on, Bill. That’s like me asking, ‘Do you want to watch the Boston Celtics?’ Come on, man. You know better. You know better.”
Smith then addressed the Kellerman situation and began with mocking Kellerman referring to himself as “Muhammad Kellerman.”
“Did we show when he called himself Muhammad Kellerman, as in Muhammad Ali Kellerman?” Smith asked. “Muhammad Ali Kellerman. If we were talking about boxing, you’re absolutely right, because I don’t know anybody that knows more boxing than Max Kellerman. He’s extraordinary. No doubt about that.”
“We’re talking about First Take, though,” Smith elaborated. “And he took it someplace, that all I want to say is, are you really sure you want to go there? See, there’s a lot of stuff that goes on behind the scenes. Are you sure you want to go there? Because I’m not unless you take me there.”
“Now, to backtrack, we worked for five years together; 2016 to 2021,” Smith said. “And yes, I didn’t think we worked together any longer. I did not want to do a debate show with Max Kellerman.”
Smith proceeded to offer kind words about Kellerman as a person before explaining why he didn’t think they were a good fit together on First Take.
“What I keep trying to explain to all of ya’ll is that, under no circumstances do I dislike or hate this dude,” Smith explained. “This ain’t some Stephen A. and Michelle Beadle thing going on where she was coming at me like that, or me going at the fat bastard. This is not that. I got news for most of ya’ll. Max Kellerman is one of the kindest dudes you’d ever want to meet. He’s actually a very nice guy. And SportsCenter, boxing, you know, whatever. No problem… If Max Kellerman wanted me to come on his show, I’d happily do it. If Max Kellerman needed a favor, and he picked up the phone to call me, no problem. That has nothing to do with wanting to work with somebody on a debate show!”
“We want to go there?,” Smith continued. “Let’s go there! Max Kellerman was succeeding Skip Bayless! Max Kellerman’s first day on the job, he said, ‘Tom Brady is a bum! He’s going to fall off a cliff!’ And the next day, he apologized.”
“But there was an audience that was accustomed to Skip Bayless being diametrically different for a decade,” Smith said, right before the yelling increased. “And when Max came on the show, the top ratings were handed to us because of what Skip and I were doing. So, the audience has an expectation for that show! That show was not Get Up! That show was not PTI! That show was not Around The Horn! That show was not SportsCenter! That show came with an expectation that the audience was looking for us to live up to! Anybody’s that’s in front of the camera has an obligation to be compelled, to be pulled towards what the audience wants, because that’s how you get ratings!”
“I want Max Kellerman to succeed,” Smith said in his closing comments. “I want that brother to do whatever his heart desires and to get what he wants from this industry as much as he possibly can. He’s a nice guy, ya’ll. He really is. Yeah, we had our tussles, and we had our disagreements, and all of that other stuff. But there was never hatred or anything like that. There was frustration from the debate show standpoint. That’s it. Nothing else. I wish him nothing but the best. And if he wants to call himself Muhammad Kellerman, knock yourself out. But Ali wasn’t undefeated. And the numerous contributors that we have on First Take, I’m very proud of them. And I’d put them up against anybody. And I’ll leave it at that.”
About Matt Clapp
Matt is an editor/writer at The Comeback and Awful Announcing.
He can be reached by email at mclapp@thecomeback.com.